Georgia Fiero Club Forum

All Things Fiero => Tech Tips, Tech Questions => Topic started by: pgackerman on January 05, 2014, 04:32:37 pm

Title: Cloudy clutch fluid after bleeding clutch slave cylinder mechanism
Post by: pgackerman on January 05, 2014, 04:32:37 pm

f85gtron and I bleed the clutch slave cylinder mechanism and went for a victory lap.  Clutch felt good, but the fluid in the reservoir is already getting cloudy.  Any ideas what's causing this and the solution?  Thanks.

Title: Re: Cloudy clutch fluid after bleeding clutch slave cylinder mechanism
Post by: TopNotch on January 05, 2014, 06:27:42 pm

Old age, most likely. Are your master and slave old? Even if they are new, the lines are old.

Title: Re: Cloudy clutch fluid after bleeding clutch slave cylinder mechanism
Post by: Fierofool on January 05, 2014, 06:36:04 pm

If it's turning gray or black, it's due to disintegration of the rubber seals.  Sometimes called Black Death.  I've had that occur in my system but still got years of service without problems.  The MC rebuild kit is pretty readily available and is a straightforward replacement.  Only Rodney Dickman's MC's are different. 

Title: Re: Cloudy clutch fluid after bleeding clutch slave cylinder mechanism
Post by: pgackerman on January 05, 2014, 08:52:53 pm

"Years of service without problems"  - That's good news.  Means this isn't an emergency fix. 

My daughter and I will keep driving it until the car acts up or our schedule gives us time to fix it.

Thanks

Title: Re: Cloudy clutch fluid after bleeding clutch slave cylinder mechanism
Post by: Fierofool on January 05, 2014, 09:52:35 pm

Years isn't a guarantee.  Just a possibility. 

Title: Re: Cloudy clutch fluid after bleeding clutch slave cylinder mechanism
Post by: pgackerman on January 06, 2014, 10:12:52 pm

I understand. 

Title: Re: Cloudy clutch fluid after bleeding clutch slave cylinder mechanism
Post by: pgackerman on January 07, 2014, 05:33:28 pm

Clutch fluid was a little low this afternoon so it looks like I need to raise the priority of this fix. 
Which end is usually the problem?  The master clutch cylinder up front or the slave in the back?

Title: Re: Cloudy clutch fluid after bleeding clutch slave cylinder mechanism
Post by: Fierofool on January 07, 2014, 06:26:21 pm

My personal experience has been that the slave goes first on a car that's been sitting.  My theory is that the slave piston sits at the back end of the bore.  The outer end of the bore is open to the atmosphere, allowing it to rust and for a varnish buildup.  When the clutch is depressed, the piston and seal must move out over these imperfections.  The MC piston sits at the front end of it's bore and it's piston travel is over an area that's not exposed to the atmosphere. 

Since fluid was low, you can determine which is leaking by pulling the rubber boot loose and looking for fluid.  Sometimes the boot will hold a considerable amount of fluid before it starts to leak out.  If you have to replace the slave, I'd recommend getting Rodney Dickman's dual seal slave.  The MC can be rebuilt with a kit from the auto parts store and should give reasonable service life but Rodney's MC is a worthwhile investment, too. 

Grab yourself some vacuum port caps off the HELP rack at the parts store.  Cap your fluid line when you disconnect it.  It keeps the fluid from running out and saves time bleeding air from the entire system. 

Title: Re: Cloudy clutch fluid after bleeding clutch slave cylinder mechanism
Post by: TopNotch on January 07, 2014, 10:56:45 pm

Look for fluid in the carpet or liner to check for a master leak.

Title: Re: Cloudy clutch fluid after bleeding clutch slave cylinder mechanism
Post by: pgackerman on January 09, 2014, 05:09:42 pm

The carpet doesn't feel wet or look more stained than usual.  The interior smells like PB Blaster, not brake fluid. 

I ordered a new slave from Rodney Dickman.  Plan on putting it in this weekend if it arrives on time.  Of course, I have questions.  There are heat shields around the slave and nearby that should be removed and do not show up in Haynes, Chiltons, or the '87 Fiero Service Manual.  However, they're bolted to the engine.  What torque value should I use to bolt them back on?

Title: Re: Cloudy clutch fluid after bleeding clutch slave cylinder mechanism
Post by: Fierofool on January 09, 2014, 07:05:17 pm

The MC can leak and not be readily visible.  It runs down behind the carpet, out of sight. 

The only heat shield that needs be removed is the one covering the slave, itself.  It's difficult to remove.  I've found it easiest by using a double offset box end wrench.

 When installing the new slave, try to fill it before attaching the fluid line.  After attaching the fluid line, leave the bleeder valve finger tight.  Holding the bleeder at the high point, have the daughter loosen then tighten it as you press in on the pushrod. That should get any remaining  air out of the system.  It only takes a small amount of travel to do so.

Be sure the heat shield is installed between the nuts and the slave flange.  Torque to whatever you feel is good and tight.  I don't think you'll get a torque wrench in there. 

Title: Re: Cloudy clutch fluid after bleeding clutch slave cylinder mechanism
Post by: TopNotch on January 09, 2014, 08:46:58 pm

To make bleeding your slave easier, get a Speed Bleeder bleed valve. They actually don't make one in the right size, but you can get one with an adapter that will fit here (http://www.racerpartswholesale.com/product/3854/Motorcycle_SpeedBleeder).

Title: Re: Cloudy clutch fluid after bleeding clutch slave cylinder mechanism
Post by: Fierofool on January 09, 2014, 10:11:54 pm

I have one of Rodney's but it absolutely doesn't work the way it's described. 

Title: Re: Cloudy clutch fluid after bleeding clutch slave cylinder mechanism
Post by: pgackerman on January 10, 2014, 04:35:25 pm

The slave is in!

I know what I'll be doing tomorrow. 

Title: Re: Cloudy clutch fluid after bleeding clutch slave cylinder mechanism
Post by: pgackerman on January 11, 2014, 01:13:16 pm

The slave is now installed.  Car feels better than when I bought it.  Amazing.  Daughter learned how to bleed the clutch.

Anyone need a used slave cylinder mechanism?  BTW, are they supposed to come apart?  The rod came out of the rubber part.

Title: Re: Cloudy clutch fluid after bleeding clutch slave cylinder mechanism
Post by: Fierofool on January 11, 2014, 05:11:19 pm

Thumbs up to you and your daughter for the joint effort.  Not only is it good to see a young one learning about the workings of a vehicle, but even better to see a parent and child sharing the time together.

The pushrod on the slave cylinder is only held in place by the rubber boot when the slave's not installed, unlike the MC pushrod that's held in by a metal disk and snap ring. 

Title: Re: Cloudy clutch fluid after bleeding clutch slave cylinder mechanism
Post by: pgackerman on January 11, 2014, 06:12:17 pm

How does one set the torque on the hose line?  I have a ratchet, but nothing open ended to measure torque.

I took my best guess based on how hard it was to get the line off.

Title: Re: Cloudy clutch fluid after bleeding clutch slave cylinder mechanism
Post by: Fierofool on January 11, 2014, 06:39:06 pm

Snug it down, then hook your fingers over the body of the wrench and tighten.  Don't grasp the wrench with your fist.  Just use the last 2 joints of your 4 fingers.  Should be tight enough.  If you have or can get, slide a piece of the plastic wire loom cover over the slave fluid line to cover it from the frame attachment point up to the metal end.  It will help insulate it from the heat of the exhaust and coolant hose.