87-88 Headlight Motor "Torque Pins" substitute

[TopNotch]

One of the headlight motors in my "new" Fiero was running on for a while after turning off the headlights. So I took apart the gear assembly from the motor, and sure enough, it was full of what looked like bread crumbs. Now, some time ago, I had bought a set of those "torque pins' (That's what the Fiero Store calls them.) but, of course, since I needed them now, I couldn't find them. So I put on my thinking cap to figure out a substitute. I happened to have a little parts drawer full of rubber grommets in various sizes, and one size was just the right diameter, and two of them stacked were just the right height. So I put those in the gear assembly and put everything back together and in the car. It seems to work just fine. I have no idea how long it will last, though.

[Raydar]

I fixed mine using 1/2" sections of fuel line. Worked okay for a while. Finally smashed them flat enough to let them slip.

[GTRS Fiero]

Home Depot sold a plastic dowel.  I just cut off a small piece.

[Fierofool]

Pat, I have some out here that came with the car.  They're old, but they're what he bought for it.  I also understand that Ford power window dowels will work.  You can get them from the HELP rack at the parts store. 

[scottb]

The Ford window motor pins will work for a year or so, then flatten out. Have experience. Next best thing to Fiero Store parts would be delrin. HDPE as a last resort.

Charlie and I pulled a late headlight system from a car in Pull a Part. Tested the system, no worky. Pulled the motors apart and found someone (I believe Charlie knows the person) had pack the gears full of heavy grease and roller bearings. That system was rebuilt and sold.

[GTRS Fiero]

What are the TFS pins made from?

[Donster]

While on the subject: 88 headlight motors, right one only opens sporadic. If I play (turn) with the spindle, it will work a few times again, then fail again.
Squeals a bit, despite lubricant, but as I stated, it will only work a few times.
Is it time to rebuild? I have experience with taking GEN 1 motors apart, but not 87/88 motors.
Any advice? If  time to rebuild, what is the best source to get parts?

Thnx,
\D

[TopNotch]

There's not much more you can do to the 88 motor besides replace the torque pins. Does the motor not run at all when it doesn't work?
One thing you can try is to disconnect the motor's wire and apply 12V to it to see what happens. One polarity (for example, plus to the blue wire and minus to the black) will raise the headlight, and the other polarity will lower it. Not sure which is which. If you can consistently raise and lower the headlight this way, suspect the wiring or controller, not the motor.
If the motor runs on after it reaches it's limit, the torque pins need replacing.

[scottb]

Not sure about 1st gen, but on 2nd gen dont lose the little ball bearing at the bottom of the shaft

[Fierofool]

The Gen 2 motors are the ones that have the tiny single BB.  The case has a screw in the bottom with a dimple in the end of it.  The motor shaft also has a dimple and the BB is sandwiched between.  Don't readjust the screw and work on a good white cloth surface so you can see that BB when it falls out.  Sometimes it might go up and stick to the magnets on the motor.

There are two things that can cause the Gen 2 motor to run on. 
1.  The drive pins have crumbled.
2.  The tripot that is shrink fitted onto the horizontal gear shaft is slipping. 

The pins can be replaced in a simple operation.  The slipping tripot has been repaired by some by drilling and inserting a pin through the tripot and shaft, but this weakens both and is a bit of a precision operation to get it right.

One of the biggest problems with reassembling the Gen 2 motor, if it's taken totally apart, is getting the motor installed back into the case.  I had to make some special retainers to keep the brushes retracted while I inserted the motor into the housing. 

The Lil Duke Coupe had the same issue with the right headlight.  If I used the headlights regularly, they worked great.  If the car sat for a week or two, the right one wouldn't come up until I bumped or turned the knob.  The 87 would only raise the headlights half way.  It turned out to be the new light switch that I put in for cosmetic reasons. 

The easiest fix is to just order a reman or new one.   
https://shop.advanceautoparts.com/web/SearchResults?storeId=10151&catalogId=10051&langId=-1&searchTerm=headlight%20motor&isFitted=1

https://www.rockauto.com/en/catalog/pontiac,1988,fiero,2.8l+173cid+v6,1249208,body,headlamp+motor,1412

[GTRS Fiero]

I used staples to hold everything in place for re-assembly.

[scottb]

Dental floss works great for holding the brushes in until everything is assembled, then pull it out

[Fierofool]

I don't remember which I used, but it was either staples, or I cut and bent pieces of paper clip.  That was after I fought with it for an hour or more. 

[Donster]

OK, so here are the symptoms:
The right motor engages ONLY IF I turn the knob a bit (Turns really hard the first few turns) before turning on the headlights.
What I notice is that the knob goes up a bit after it is finished opening or closing. The driver's side does not do that. It is as if there is too much play in the (spindle?).
Is this some kind of indication of what might be wrong?
I've checked the module under the left fender well and all cables going to the motor. Also checked all grounds, they are all fine?

Any ideas?

Thnx!

[TopNotch]

The little ball bearing at the bottom of the shaft is probably missing.